Text of Arizona’s Anti-Illegal Immigration Law – Part 2

Text of New Arizona Revised Statutes Section 13-1509 as revised by House Bill 2162 (effective July 29, 2010).  Deletions to text made by HB 2162 are show in red text that is lined out and new language is this color and underlined.  This post does not contain the entire text of the new law.  The entire law is contained in this part 2 and in:

13-1509.  Trespassing by illegal aliens; assessment; exception; classification

A.  In addition to any violation of federal law, a person is guilty of trespassing if the person is both:

1.  Present on any public or private land in this state.
2.  In violation of 8 United States Code section 1304(e)

[KEYTLaw Comment – Section 1304(e) states: “Every alien, eighteen years of age and over, shall at all times carry with him and have in his personal possession any certificate of alien registration or alien registration receipt card issued to him pursuant to subsection (d) of this section. Any alien who fails to comply with the provisions of this subsection shall be guilty of a misdemeanor and shall upon conviction for each offense be fined not to exceed $100 or be imprisoned not more than thirty days, or both.”] or 1306(a).  [KEYTLaw Comment – Section 1306(a) states: “Any alien required to apply for registration and to be fingerprinted in the United States who willfully fails or refuses to make such application or to be fingerprinted, and any parent or legal guardian required to apply for the registration of any alien who willfully fails or refuses to file application for the registration of such alien shall be guilty of a misdemeanor and shall, upon conviction thereof, be fined not to exceed $1,000 or be imprisoned not more than six months, or both.]

B.  In the enforcement of this section, the final determination of an alien’s immigration status shall be determined by either:

1.  A law enforcement officer who is authorized by the federal government to verify or ascertain an alien’s immigration status.
2.  A law enforcement officer or agency communicating with the United States immigration and customs enforcement or the United States border protection pursuant to 8 United States Code section 1373(c) [KEYTLaw Comment – Section 1373(c) states: “The Immigration and Naturalization Service shall respond to an inquiry by a Federal, State, or local government agency, seeking to verify or ascertain the citizenship or immigration status of any individual within the jurisdiction of the agency for any purpose authorized by law, by providing the requested verification or status information.]

C.  A law enforcement official or agency of this state or a county, city, town or other political subdivision of this state may not consider race, color or national origin in the enforcement of this section except to the extent permitted by the United States or Arizona constitution.

DC.  A person who is sentenced pursuant to this section is not eligible for suspension or commutation of sentence or release on any basis until the sentence imposed is served.

ED.  In addition to any other penalty prescribed by law, the court shall order the person to pay jail. costs and an additional assessment in the following amounts:

1.  At least five hundred dollars for a first violation.
2.  Twice the amount specified in paragraph 1 of this subsection if the person was previously subject to an assessment pursuant to this subsection.

E.  A court shall collect the assessments prescribed in subsection D of this section and remit the assessments to the department of public safety, which shall establish a special subaccount for the monies in the account established for the gang and immigration intelligence team enforcement mission appropriation.  Monies in the special subaccount are subject to legislative appropriation for distribution for gang and immigration enforcement and for county jail reimbursement costs relating to illegal immigration.

F.  This section does not apply to a person who maintains authorization from the federal government to remain in the United States.

G.  A violation of this section is a class 1 misdemeanor, except that a violation of this section is:

1.  A class 3 felony if the person violates this section while in possession of any of the following:

(a)  A dangerous drug as defined in section 13-3401.
(b)  Precursor chemicals that are used in the manufacturing of methamphetamine in violation of section 13-3404.01.
(c)  A deadly weapon or a dangerous instrument, as defined in section 13-105.
(d)  Property that is used for the purpose of committing an act of terrorism as prescribed in section 13-2308.01.

2.  A class 4 felony if the person either:

(a)  Is convicted of a second or subsequent violation of this section.
(b)  Within sixty months before the violation, has been removed from the United States pursuant to 8 United States Code section 1229a or has accepted a voluntary removal from the United States pursuant to 8 United States Code section 1229c.

H.  A violation of this section is a class 1 misdemeanor, except that the maximum fine is one hundred dollars and for a first violation of this section is: the court shall not sentence the person to more than twenty days in jail and for a second or subsequent violation the court shall not sentence the person to more than thirty days in jail.

1.  A class 3 felony if the person violates this section while in possession of any of the following:

(a)  A dangerous drug as defined in section 13-3401.
(b)  Precursor chemicals that are used in the manufacturing of methamphetamine in violation of section 13-3404.01.
(c)  A deadly weapon or a dangerous instrument, as defined in section 13-105.
(d)  Property that is used for the purpose of committing an act of terrorism as prescribed in section 13-2308.01.

2.  A class 4 felony if the person either:

(a)  Is convicted of a second or subsequent violation of this section.
(b)  Within sixty months before the violation, has been removed from the United States pursuant to 8 United States Code section 1229a or has accepted a voluntary removal from the United States pursuant to 8 United States Code section 1229c.

See the text of the entire Senate Bill 1070.

2017-06-02T21:33:15+00:00

31 Comments

  1. Beverly Caron April 29, 2010 at 7:25 am

    Obviously you do not actually wish any comments…….you rejected a perfectly good email address. I shall now try to re-generate my comments and use another perfectly good email address.

    Arizona immigration fight to move to the courtroom – latimes.com **
    The ACLU and other groups say the key legal issue is whether the state law interferes with the federal government’s duty to handle immigration.

    What a specious argument:
    1. The federal government has done absolutely nothing to even attempt to solve this problem. You can hardly interfere with nothing.

    2. Arizona’s new law has nothing to do with immigration…….the question is a matter of criminality, the people in question are not immigrants of any sort, they are border jumping criminals who have no right to be here. An illegal alien does not gain any status as an immigrant simply by squatting here for a prescribed amount of time.

    I might point out as well that not all of those targeted are Mexican, they just happen to be the most vocal, and the probable perpetrators of incidents (refried beans, anyone) and one person taped shouting that they would use their rakes and shovels on Arizonans……….nice people wouldn’t you say?

    • James April 29, 2010 at 3:22 pm

      If these were white color folks your song would change in a heart beat Beverly. I can not wait when our good neighbors from the north visit us here in Arizona from Canada. I seriously doubt they will have their papers everywhere they travel or get profiled, which is the true argument here, and the main reason behind all the shouting, in case you really have not notice or opened your closed mind too. Silly woman.

      • Pedro Martiz May 13, 2010 at 5:42 pm

        James,

        You poor, ignorant fellow! The law clearly states “A law enforcement official or agency of this state or a county, city, town or other political subdivision of this state may not consider race, color or national origin in the enforcement…” Furthermore, Canadians immigrants, as any immigrant, is required by federal law to have in their possession and show identification to legal authorities! I am a Naturalized Citizen and know this for a fact.

        Try to travel abroad and not have your US passport on your possession.

    • James April 29, 2010 at 3:38 pm

      To my dear country woman who has not read clearly:
      ARTICLE 8. ENFORCEMENT OF IMMIGRATION LAWS 11-1051. Read what it says, Paragraph B. FOR ANY LAWFUL CONTACT MADE BY A LAW ENFORCEMENT OFFICIAL OR AGENCY OF THIS STATE OR A COUNTY, CITY, TOWN OR OTHER POLITICAL SUBDIVISION OF THIS STATE WHERE REASONABLE SUSPICION EXISTS THAT THE PERSON IS AN ALIEN WHO IS UNLAWFULLY PRESENT IN THE UNITED STATES, A REASONABLE ATTEMPT SHALL BE MADE. In order for any human being to have and reasonable suspicion of anything in life they by the act of human nature must with out a doubt have to have a “PROFILE” to fit that missing link. Which is against the law…!!!! You can not suspect anyone from being gay unless they fit the profile .. You can not SUSPECT!!!! without Profile!!!! That is what gives reason to ask!! PROFILE!! You can not just guess and randomly point at a subject or object unless they fit the description!!!! Which is PROFILE!!!HELLO!!! WAKE UP!!! It is not the illegal part that they are shouting about!!!! How like it if I put you in a category of men thinking you are man, when you sound like one? My mistake.. I would not know that you were a woman but because I profiled by sound you were a woman to me. Just a sample how many people will be mistaken.

      • Dana April 29, 2010 at 5:22 pm

        James,

        You evidently did not read the first four words of the text you cited. Let me post it for you: FOR ANY LEGAL CONTACT … did you get the word LEGAL? The law is not to profile, the law is to protect LEGAL citizens. If an undocumented person does not break the law, which then would not present a SUSPICION, then they have nothing to worry about. And by the way, canadians are required to carry citizenship documents with them at all times according to federal Law.

        • Bob May 12, 2010 at 8:26 am

          I understand your thought, but as a person with 35-years of law enforcement experience, legal contact is an issue because victims of rape, robbery, extortion, burglary, and those with children that are physically and sexually abused will not call the police because when that officer arrives there exists a legal contact and the victims would likely face deportation. Most large police departments prohibit officers from enforcing federal immigration laws because law enforcement seeks the cooperation of all community members that may witness a crime or wish to inform the police about drug dealers and other criminals. There are many ways, other than committing a crime, where you may come into legal contact with a police officer. Your neighbor could call the police an accuse you of any number of things. Police officers receive anonymous calls all the time. You could be a crime victim or witness. You could be in an accident.

          Please explain when it is illegal for a law enforcement officer to contact you. In fact, I just did! If I receive an anonymous note that says you are an illegal immigrant and if you speak with an accent, I have a s reasonable suspicion to investigate your legal status.

          Let me put it together for you. A citizen of Hispanic descent is walking with some friends and discovers his wallet is missing. He calls the police. He speaks with a heavy accent. The officer reasonably suspects this person may not be a citizen. The citizen is no longer a man trying to report a lost wallet. He is now a suspect. For his own safety, the officer pats down the ‘suspect’ to make certain he is unarmed. I certainly would. So now we have a man that is humiliated in front of friends and family because he may have entered the United States years ago without proper paperwork.

          What if your 13-year old runs away from home and you are an illegal alien? Do you risk the deportation by calling the police? Let’s get more real. The 13 year old was born in the U.S.A. Now you can be deported and if the child is found – what becomes of the child?

          The issue of illegal immigration policies are too complex to copy Mexican or Canadian laws.

          If the legislature intended to limit officers from investigating immigration status to those that violated the law, then this bill would be written that way.

          • Pedro Martiz May 13, 2010 at 5:56 pm

            Bob,

            Interesting, but I respect the judgment of law enforcement officers when confronting any individual that they would first want to properly identify that individual. I have been in the situation you mentioned in the past when I was a “Resident Alien” and had to show proof of my identity. I had to stay in the police office for 3 hours until proof of my identity and then proof of my status could be proven. I expect and hope all law enforcement entities are that dedicated and professional to “Serve and Protect”! (BTW, I was 13 at the time and was separated from my parent. My parent came to where I was being held to bring my “Resident Alien” card, that is why it took 3 hours.)

      • Tom April 29, 2010 at 6:23 pm

        James, your detailed explanation of “profiling” is interesting, consider this situation as well, A bank alarm is ringing and a man in a mask is running away, is it “profiling” to stop him with articulable reason for bank robbery and then ask his immigration status or can we not stop him b/c it would be “profiling”

        • Tom is not too bright May 15, 2010 at 7:30 am

          You, sir, are an imbecile.

  2. Joseph April 30, 2010 at 6:41 am

    James detailed explanation of profiling is basically correct. However, he overlooks a critical element in the Arizona Law. There is no problem with profiling, per se. The problem is profiling based on race or ethnicity. What this means is that a law enforcement official cannot simply require everyone with brown skin who happens to speak Spanish to produce their identification documents. First there must be legal contact,(That is there must be some other legal reason to interact with the person)then and then only may the officer require the production of identification documents. Race or ethnicity may be one of the factors that may be considered by the official but cannot even then be the only reason. The other factors to be considered can and should be such things as where the stop is taking place(is it in a location where it is known that many illegal aliens cross the border; Does the person respond to questions in a vague or non-responsive manner; Does the subject answer questions vaguely on non-responsively). In addition, once reasonable suspicion has been established(and the threshold is very low, like probable cause{failure to give a verifiable US address or phone number})the officer has the right to require that any person with whom he has legal contact produce documentation that he or she is in the country legally. That includes 85 year old blond blue eyed great grandmothers as well as overweight people with brown skin who don’t speak English. In other words, everyone must be treated equally. Now it is true that someone will surely act in bad faith. But that is what we have courts and lawyers for. If the request for documents is challenged in a court of law, the burden is on the officer to prove that his suspicion was reasonable and not based solely on racial profiling. No, the courts are not perfect either. But they are the very best in the world. Sorry, but life is not always fair to everyone all the time.

  3. Tim April 30, 2010 at 9:19 am

    Terry Law, this is just like Terry Law, Cops can legally ask for id anytime the want, citizen or not, black, white purple, brown, blue, or any skin color. You can politely decline, but in a Terry stop, where you’ve committed a crime, you are required to show id if the law ask you to. These laws are already in place, Arizona is just rewriting old laws in order to get everyone to notice this problem of crime running over that border, and jobs being taken from american citizens, will it solve the whole problem, no but it’s bringing it to the forefront. Any cop can ask you for id, and when there is a suspicion of you breaking a law, that is for citizens and non citizens, from washington to NY to Florida to LA, and anyone in between. READ THE DAMN LAW, STOP USING THE LIBERAL MEDIA AS YOUR REFERENCES!!! THEY ARE IN FACT FEAR MONGERING, UNTIL I READ THE LAW I THOUGHT YOU HAD TO SHOW YOUR BIRTH CERTIFICATE, THAT IS FALSE, READ THE LAW!!!

  4. Lisa Huff April 30, 2010 at 5:37 pm

    We are a nation of immigrants. LEGAL immigrants. We have had laws on the books since the nation was born concerning immigration. The laws are meant to protect the nation’s sovereignty and numerous protections for tax paying citizens. All countries have immigration laws and enforce them, especially Mexico. The US does not enforce its own immigration laws, for mysterious underlying reasons. We, the people of the US should demand our government follow its own laws. The laws are there for very good reasons. People keep confusing racism with immigration laws, raciscm has nothing to do with it. People say the illegal immigrants are taking jobs Americans don’t want. That’s not true and never has been. You are all being fooled by greedy politicians who want to keep their imported voting base, and by US corporations who want cheap, agreeable labor. Such a shame.

    • L May 10, 2010 at 5:50 pm

      Oh? I wasn’t aware that immigrants, legal or no, could even vote? And I’m pretty sure its much harder to immigrate legally now, rather than just packing on a boat and sailing over as some could years ago. They do work that Americans may want to do, but they do it for a price Americans won’t. And if this is a capitalist society, we should want as cheap labor as possible.

      • Lisa May 11, 2010 at 5:33 am

        Illegal immigrants can’t vote, but some do. It’s the irrational votes of illegal immigration supporters that the politicians want. And it is not harder to immigrate legally now, but it is not easy or free and there is good reason for it. And no, we don’t want slave labor wages here. Continually lowering the unskilled labor wages makes for a country like Mexico, or China. Illegal immigrants are taking the jobs American citizens want, and they are reducing our labor pool to slave wages. The American corporations are the illegal immigrant’s masters now, and believe me, they are not your friends. American corporations are using illegal immigrants.

        Quick story; We had a small delivery business, for over 25 years, with 60 low-paid citizen employees (many were legal immigrants). About five years ago our competitor began hiring illegal aliens for a smaller wage, and without paying the required employment taxes (which are quite high), and taking so-called ‘insurance’ money directly from their pay without actually providing insurance, and made them work 12 hours per day without overtime. This put our competitor at a great advantage, saving tons of money by not paying employment taxes, paying the worker near-slave wages, and making some money on the side by forcing them to pay for bunk insurance policies. They were able to underbid our very low bids and they took our accounts. Sixty low paid citizen employees, who very much wanted their jobs, lost their jobs. During the five years it took for this company to take our business through ignoring employment laws and regulations, we complained to the state authorities who did nothing to stop them. They now control the entire Western half of the U.S.’s small deliveries and their illegal business practices continue.

        Illegal immigrants are being used and fooled by American businesses who would rather cheat the employee and the taxing system than compete on a level playing field. They make much more money using illegal immigrant labor, and that’s all they care about.

      • Pedro Martiz May 15, 2010 at 9:20 am

        If you are having problems with understanding the history of immigration in The United States go here http://www.rapidimmigration.com/usa/1_eng_immigration_history.html and if you are prejudice to current immigration conditions and practices based on those prior to US immigration legislation, you are making a mistake and err in judgment. Example: It was legal for men in the 1800s to physically beat their wives, it is not legal now, and the defense that it was once legal to beat them will not pass muster today!

  5. Robin May 3, 2010 at 9:37 pm

    All the talk about profiling,,, humm ever been to Mexico? Mexico requires vistors to carry passports and visa’s at all times. Any police officer can stop and ask you for them and they do not need probable cause. If you are a White person in a rurual area you will likely be stopped and questioned by the local police. If you don’t have your visa papers/passport with you, they will take you to jail and you will be lucky if all they do is kick you out. Mexico is pretty vigilant about searcing and ejecting you if you over stay your visa. If a third world country can have strict laws for dealing with illegal immigrants then why not the US? Just because Mexico has a boarder with us does not entitle their citizens to bypass the immigration process. Illegally slipping over the boarder and living here does not entitle you to automatic citizenship anymore then it would a US citizen in Mexico. I am also familar with Canada’s immigration laws concerning Mexican workers in the horse industry and I can tell you Canda is EXTEMELY tough about ensuring any non-Candians go back home. Candian police and immigration officers do not worry about profiling or probable cause either, under Candian law they have to right to ask for your passport and/or visa at anytime and kick you out or detain you if you can’t provide them. When we go horse showing in Canada, our farms Mexican workers will not leave the show grounds because they know they will stopped and questioned. And yes our farms workers all have their paperwork, which we help them obtain legally. Illegal immigrants cost us money; we pay to educate their children, we pay their medical expenses when they can’t, and they do take jobs away from US citizens – particularly in todays high jobless rate. I have no sympathy for illegal immigrants pleas for citizenship when they have entered and lived here illegally. Illegal aliens are breaking the law, they are criminals and they should proscuted as such. The US government should have addressed this issue many years ago because now it is a big issue. I also understand why Mexico’s citizens want to come here as their income prospects in Mexico are poor, especially for the darker skinned peoples. Mexico is very raciest towards it’s own people and the darker their skin is the more doors are shut to them as far as advancement in jobs. The truth is that the citizens of Mexico need to take charge and address their own countries issues not avoid them by coming here.

  6. Bob May 12, 2010 at 8:06 am

    Hello. I am a white American with 35-years of law enforcement experience. After reading the posts, I want to offer a few thoughts.

    I remember a time when law enforcement officers were taught how to profile criminals. “This is what a person smuggling drugs looks like.” The person’s ethnicity AND other observations were used to determine if there was a reasonable suspicion to question the person and if there was the higher degree of suspicion to determine a probable cause to search and arrest. When at war with terrorist who have a common ethnicity, it makes no sense to randomly stop little old grandmothers at airports. So, profiling is not racism. If the law states that officers must question people when there is a reasonable suspicion that they are in the United States illegally, ethnicity is one factor that is used, since most illegal aliens are Hispanic. Several problems will occur as a result of the new Arizona law. Any Hispanic without a knowledge of English may subjected to questioning. This is not the same as questioning a person that has drugs in his or her possession. Law enforcement is investigating a violation of federal law that may have occurred a decade ago. As a law enforcement professional I can assure you that most officers are honest, hardworking people doing a very thankless job. I can also tell you that there will certainly be unbelievable temptations. What would a woman be willing to do when she knows the officer’s actions will result in her deportation and possible separate her from her children? Furthermore, how many city police officers will be injured because an otherwise law abiding person knows he or she will be sent back into a place where their children are always hungry?

    Some will argue that a law abiding person, by definition, abides by the law and that by definition all illegal aliens are not law abiding. By that logic, every person that exceeded the speed limit (even 10 years ago) is not a law abiding citizen. Anyone that ever drove a motor vehicle when they consumed more than 3 drinks during the last hour, is not law abiding. Carrying the definition of words a step further, if you ever – in your entire life – told a lie, by definition you are a liar. Yes, a person that entered the United States illegally broke the law, but can be described as a law abiding person.

    The solution to illegal immigration is to resolve the reasons for the crime of entering the United States without approved paperwork. Require the United States to obey the N.A.F.T.A. treaty our government signed. Eliminate farm subsidized to farmers exporting massive amounts of corn to Mexico. (The Mexican farmer cannot compete with the U.S. farmers because our government subsidizes the cost for our farmers. The U.S. is the major provider of corn to Mexico). Require U.S. companies that send jobs to other countries to pay a fair living wage. This may accomplish two things. When people can earn a living wage, they will not need to leave their families and come here where they can earn a living wage. Less U.S. jobs will be exported.

    Most important, go after the people hiring illegal workers. Instead of arresting one person at a time, punish the employers so that they cannot ever profit by hiring people without proof of citizenship. Arizona already defined specific documents that must be accepted by law enforcement as proof of citizenship, so this is simple. The motivation for illegal entry is gone when there are no jobs. An analogy can be made to the war on drugs. Are we better served by arresting a thousand users or ten big time drug dealers? Carrying this analogy further, would we like to see gang-bangers, members of Mexican drug cartels and illegal aliens that commit felonies deported OR should we tie up our law enforcement efforts to deport working, law abiding illegal aliens? (Yes, I understand they broke the law one time when they entered the country. But would it not be better to have law enforcement efforts used to crush the criminal scum?) Ideally, law enforcement would accomplish both things – but you would need more officers. Many more officers. Furthermore, law enforcement needs the cooperation of the Hispanic community to identify and arrest the cartel members and gang-bangers.

    It is telling that the Arizona law does not require every law enforcement agency to dedicate specific resources to identify and arrest cartel and gang members in the country illegally or to aggressively pursue employers and those trafficking in illegal immigrants. It would be better if we admitted that our number one concern is not crime, jobs or tax burdens, but that we fear the change in our culture and the evolving national identity changes that a huge increase in Hispanics is bringing about. If we focused on these legitimate concerns we would find that nothing can be done because of the disproportionate birth rates among our legal population. That’s right. Our children (and many of us) will see the time when the Hispanic population will dominate the country. I wonder if the people wanting a ‘national language’ will still want one when the Hispanics outnumber ‘us’.

    I have never heard a person say, “I came to the U.S. because my income prospects were poor in Mexico”, as posted on this site. They frequently talk about not being able to feed their children and that they became so desperate to feed their family that they risked their lives crossing into the United States where they hoped to find work so they could send money home to the wife and children.

    Most police agencies prohibit officers from questioning citizenship because law enforcement needs the cooperation of these people when investigating crimes. A woman that is raped is not likely to call the police when doing so results in a LAWFUL POLICE CONTACT and the end result is that the rape victim is deported. That rapist does it again and rapes people regardless of their citizenship. Also, when crimes are committed against citizens, law enforcement needs help from witnesses, regardless of their ethnicity of immigration status. Most successful detectives quickly admit that without cooperation from the public, fewer crimes are solved. Arguing that there are fewer crimes when illegals are eliminated is the same as arguing that fewer crimes are committed if African Americans are eliminated, or if Catholics are eliminated, or if Evangelicals are eliminated. We, as a society, do not know the impact on crime that is caused by illegal immigrants. The biggest problem in determining the amount of crime committed by illegal aliens it that most police agencies prohibit officers from asking arrested and charged suspects about citizenship status. This is changed by the Arizona law and every state should enact that portion of the bill.

    The issue of jobs being taken by illegals is solved when employers are severely punished for hiring people without proof of citizenship or legal status. There is a lot of intelligent debate about the cost of illegal aliens. They pay the same taxes, pay into a Social Security System from which they cannot collect, yet they may use a disproportional amount of ‘free’ medical services. There is an impact on schools as more and more bilingual classes are required. This part of the debate can be argued intelligently by both sides.

    The Hispanic people are often the most passionate in the national arguments about immigration. Many, resent being associated with the illegals and are on the extreme right of the issue because they followed the rules and are legal citizens and do not want the stigma of the illegals attached to them. Other Hispanics are on the left of the issue because they do not want to feel like second class citizens simply because they are Hispanic. Many Hispanic people have relatives and friends that are in the United States illegally. They know people that were deported, with children left behind.

    People with sincere and genuine desires to see illegal immigration stopped are harmed when racist comments (like refried beans, anyone?) are posted. Keeping the discussion sincere, civil and honest is the best way to have immigration rules enforced. It is easy to find examples of people from any race or with any citizenship status that break the law, curse and throw temper tantrums. The issue is much bigger than those examples.

    I am glad for the Arizona law because it has generated a serious national debate. Until the courts overturn the law, the debate will grow. It is my hope that xenophobia proposals are overcome and that the focus shifts to hammering employers with laws that include asset forfeiture so they can not profit from hiring illegal aliens and targeting gang members and felons that are in the United States illegally. With my lifetime of law enforcement experience, I can assure everyone that if we have a national identify card and require people to produce papers, the job of protecting people will be much easier. I can also tell you that as a citizen of the freest and most wonderful country on the planet, I would never want such a thing. We are not a nation of walls, identity papers and not a nation where police officers have any right to say, ‘show me your papers’ when we call the police to report a crime. We must never sacrifice liberty for a feeling that we are safer.

    • Lisa May 13, 2010 at 7:59 am

      “Most large police departments prohibit officers from enforcing federal immigration laws because law enforcement seeks the cooperation of all community members that may witness a crime or wish to inform the police about drug dealers and other criminals.” Are illegal immigrants immune to misdemeanor enforcement because the police want them to inform on the bad guys? Would the illegal immigrant tell the nice officer about a Cartel operation just because the status was not questioned? I really doubt it, because if they inform, their family dies. Do you really think that ‘most’ police departments who prohibit their officers from enforcing the immigration laws are doing it to help solve crime? Arizona’s new law is an attempt to break the prohibition of enforcing immigration laws and to enforce the laws that the government of the United States won’t enforce (for some reason which I could make a few good guesses at).

      I’ve lived in S. California for 27 years and witnessed the massive illegal immigration over the past 7 years and the very serious problems that came with it. Our family business and its 60 employees became victims of illegal immigration and we are just one of many. Crime and unemployment soared. Political crime soared. Our tax dollars disappeared into a vacuum of services sucked up by illegal immigrants and ‘payola’ bribery schemes. Services which most working citizens cannot afford, are given to the illegal immigrants and paid for by the working citizens. The businesses that allow illegal immigrants to work for them at near slave wages pay out very little, if any, in employment, social security and medicare taxes and in the end, the working citizens pay for it. Our schools and streets have become battle grounds. Most of our politicians eagerly take bribes (they call the bribes ‘campaign donations’) from the Mexican Cartel. Those who don’t accept the Cartel’s money are offered a choice; “Take the bribe or the bullet”. The human and drug smugglers work for the Cartel. The illegal immigrants are forced to carry drugs and to do the bidding of the Cartel, and the relationship doesn’t end once they are safely inside our borders. Cartel relationships end only with death. I could go on and on with more examples of the devastation of California. I can wrap it up in three words “California has fallen”.

      Now that the state has been thoroughly robbed and there is no money left to pay out, the Los Angeles mayor wants to suspend sidewalk maintenance, among many other essential services that our taxes have traditionally paid for. Ever been to Mexico and seen their crumbling sidewalks? Some people here (average citizens) are required to follow the law and pay for everything, and other people who have money, connections, or are useful to the reigning Cartel are not required to follow the law or contribute to the tax coffers. A lot like Mexico too. Our cities are in the last throes of decline and our government is corrupt. Just like Mexico. Why would the illegal immigrants, who are fleeing a country they are unhappy with, want to duplicate the situation here in the U.S?

      The illegal immigrants dislike the citizens and are very willing to show it. Many have been told and believe that California belongs to Mexico. A few years ago, I heard the then President of Mexico tell his citizens that California was a Mexican state. They believe the citizens of California should pay for their living as some sort of penance for residing in ‘their’ country. They are vocally and physically violent to anyone who complains. Our children are terrorized in the schools. Many feel that if they are against this madness, then they must be ‘racists’ because that is what every public official and talking head tells them. So many uneducated, fearful citizens will refrain from complaint or try to make themselves feel better by joining the irrational thought of the pro-illegal immigrant group. Beware, the illegal immigrants in the Western U.S. are becoming militarized, and they really don’t like their hosts. Being ‘nice’ about this is ill-advised.

      I’ve watched and studied this for years and could go on and on with more details and facts that are suppressed by big Business, which runs our big Government. But lastly I’d like to address this: “The issue of illegal immigration policies are too complex to copy Mexican or Canadian laws.” That’s crazy. Canada and Mexico do not have immigration problems because they enforce their immigration laws. Canada’s law is very civil, almost just like the U.S. immigration laws that are on the books but not enforced. Mexico’s immigration law is not civil, it is harsh, unreasonable and enforced.
      Lisa

    • tvslady June 7, 2010 at 1:25 pm

      Just a little FYI AFTER reading many of the comments made. #1. All an employer can do is ask for the legal paperwork given to the individual looking for a job. IF the papers, cards and license “looks” correct, the employer may hire the person to which applied. PROBLEM: J Schmuckatelly turns in all required paperwork asked for to the employer. The paperwork actually belongs to a brothers’ friend’s cousin (three times removed) who went to Mr. Lawbreaker with J’s picture for an ID stating he is from Guatamala. The illegal now takes the paperwork to DMV and gets a license (based on someone else’s “paperwork”)and gets a legal license to drive. The Employer, who is unknowingly hiring an illegal, gives him the job. Mr Lawman stops J for a traffic violation. Mr Lawman sees the drivers license and puts the face with the name in the system and it comes out that he is “licensed” to drive. After working for a few years (possibly under the table or legally) he was found not to be legal citizen after all, why should the employer be fined, penalized or lose his license? Believe it or not, this happens more often than most realize. The “PAPERWORK” the illegals have are just that…. ‘paper’.

      I do not care to have the number of illegal’s in my country (I am 3/4 Native American Indian) but it does not mean I have issues with the legal ones. I think what Arizona did was absolutely necessary but I think it should be under Federal Law and not individually State mandated. One of my great(x#) grandfather’s came on one of the first ships to hit America (yes, I have it documented!). We (Native American Indians) were over-taken by progress and have adapted. IF other nations people want to live here, that is fine, do it through proper channels. If I were to go live in Timbuktoo, I would be expected to speak in the language that was there, work and pay my way through their established rules and regulations and except that their way is correct. All I am saying is, IF YOU WANT TO LIVE, LEARN, ENJOY LIFE AS AN AMERICAN, DO SO FULLY AND DON’T FORCE YOUR POINTS, LANGUAGE AND RELIGIOUS NOTIONS ON MY LIFESTYLE! EVERY GENERATION OF MY FAMILY HAS FOUGHT TO KEEP THIS WONDERFUL COUNTRY IN FREEDOM! WE STILL DO TODAY AND I AM BOTH PROUD AND HONORED TO BE A PART OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA. :o) Have a great day!

  7. Tom May 12, 2010 at 5:30 pm

    Bob,

    You make some excellent points and I agree with you on many of them including targeting the drug cartels and employers of Illegal Aliens. I do however have a couple of points that should also be raised.
    1. just because an illegal alien broke the law ten years ago doesn’t mean they should receive amnesty now. Using that logic, if I robbed a bank today and they didn’t catch me until tomorrow, does that mean I am free to go without retribution.
    2. while it would be very sad if parents and children are seperated, I do not believe that is a good excuse, again, if you broke some other laws, can you avoid jail time b/c you have children that would be alone?
    3. While I do agree that if you go after the employers of illegal immigrants, and I think we should pursue them, I am afraid that taking away the jobs for illegal immigrants will not necessarily convince them to return to their native land, I would be afraid that they would end up on welfare and a further burden to the system.
    4. The fear of “show me your papers” is not that big of deal, first immigrants are required by federal law to carry thier green cards now, and we have not heard any complaints about the fed law and second, I live in Mass and we are required to prove we have health insurance when filing taxes (as will everybody when the new healthcare takes effect). and last when you are pulled over in the car what are the first thing the officer says no matter what race or ethnicity you are, “license and registration please” which are jus tother “papers” that we are required to carry and show upon request.

    The Arizona Law may not be a “hall of fame law” but it is a starting point for them to deal with a very real problem. Very similar to the new Federal Healthcare law is not the greatest, but is rather a starting point to solve a real problem.

  8. illegal mexican May 13, 2010 at 7:03 am

    mexicans are cool and should be allowed to jump fences in Arizona. Also we are good at sooccer and the arizona white boy soccer team needs mexicans to be good.

    • Lisa May 13, 2010 at 8:01 am

      A sample of their mind-set.

    • Carol May 14, 2010 at 8:49 am

      Mexicans are only cool when they come into the US legally. Then you if you are good enough to make it onto a U. S. soccer team we’ll see just how good you really are. How about that?

    • Pedro Martiz May 15, 2010 at 9:24 am

      This is laughable!!!!

  9. Ken May 13, 2010 at 3:19 pm

    So I’m not done reading the entire bill yet, but thus far it seems to me that the bill only makes it illegal for members of the Arizona state government to make policies restricting enforcement of immigration law, and states that it is a misdemeanor to be out in public as a non-naturalized alien and not have your green card with you, which is clearly stated in US federal law as referenced in this bill.

  10. Joseph E. Rossman May 14, 2010 at 5:04 pm

    Now, let me throw a new viewpoint into the mix. Life would be great if everything were black and white with no shade of gray. I have a great grandson who is 5 years old. His father is a 35 year old Mexican who came to the US with his father when he was 14. His father is a legal resident but never went through the process for his son. He speaks good English and works hard to support his family. He and my granddaughter are no longer together, but as an attorney, I helped him to legitimate the child and he and my granddaughter came to an agreement regarding visitation and child support. He works hard for a local construction company, pays his taxes through the withholding system. He pays his child support every week on time and in full. He has been in the US for over 20 years, was arrested one time for DUI but does not drink or smoke now. He exercises his visitation almost every weekend and is devoted to my great grandson. He frequently buys the child extra clothing over and above the child support. He has shown himself to be a good solid productive member of your community.
    Now I am all for enforcing our immigration laws and truly closing the borders down. But Miguel came here during the time when we were practically begging aliens to cross the border. We invited him here. For that reason, I believe that there needs to be a means for those who have done as Miguel has done to have a path at least to legal residency without having to destroy the productive lives they have lived in this country.
    So my position is that the borders need to be closed tightly now and anyone who has not been in this country at least 10 years with a clean and productive record should be sent back to their own countries. But those who have shown themselves to be responsible and productive members of society should have an opportunity to become legal.

  11. @Joseph Rossman May 15, 2010 at 8:25 am

    So if Miguel had only been here 10 years, would you suggest that anybody that has been here for 5 years and has a clean and productive record should be sent home? My father was born in Germany in 1952 to an American father and German mother who were not married until 1953, at which point they all came to the US. Despite the fact that my father’s father was a US citizen from birth, my father still went through the citizenship process, just to be safe. Unfortunately, Miguel’s father screwed him by not going through the process. Miguel has also screwed himself by living here for 21 years and not doing it either. Surely at some point in the last two decades he could’ve at least started the process.

    Let me tell you another story. Ming Sun came to the US from China with his parents when he was 6 years old. His parents live in California, where they have a very successful restaurant, and have been legal immigrants with their family the entire time. They have gone through the path to citizenship, which they should be almost done with now from what Ming’s father told me the last time we talked.

    Ming Sun joined the US Army, and was deployed to Iraq, where he was killed by a sniper in January 2007. Upon his death, he was given posthumous citizenship, which would’ve been awarded him upon completion of his initial enlistment. His parents, despite the loss of their only son, are still going through the immigration process.

    You say that Miguel should have an opportunity to become legal, he HAS the opportunity, and he doesn’t even have to join the army to do it! He’s had the opportunity for 21 years! He just hasn’t taken advantage of it. How can you say that Miguel and others like him should have amnesty, but then tell Ming’s father that he has to go through the naturalization process, taking several years to become a full citizen? People make it sound like it’s impossible for Mexicans to come here legally, but the truth is that they’re too lazy, afraid of rejection, or whatever other reason they have, to do it. Why go through years of paperwork, verification, and dealing with lazy government bureaucrats when you can just walk across the border and hang out in front of Home Depot every morning until somebody comes and hires you to weed their front yard?

    • Joseph E. Rossman May 15, 2010 at 1:20 pm

      I am not an immigration attorney. If you know of a way that he can seek proper documentation without having to return to Mexico and spend years waiting I am certainly open to suggestions. In the meantime, He is not a burden on our society and is meeting his obligations as a father and a taxpayer.

  12. Lisa May 15, 2010 at 9:10 am

    A summary of Mexico’s immigration laws:

    1 There will be no special bilingual programs in the schools.
    * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
    2. All ballots will be in this nation’s language.
    * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
    3. All government business will be conducted in our language.
    * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
    4. Non-residents will NOT have the right to vote no matter how long they are here.
    * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
    5. Non-citizens will NEVER be able to hold political office
    * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
    6 Foreigners will not be a burden to the taxpayers. No welfare, no food stamps, no health care, or other government assistance programs. Any burden will be deported.
    * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
    7. Foreigners can invest in this country, but it must be an amount at least equal to 40,000 times the daily minimum wage.
    * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
    8. If foreigners come here and buy land… options will be restricted. Certain parcels including waterfront property are reserved for citizens naturally born into this country.
    * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
    9.. Foreigners may have no protests; no demonstrations, no waving of a foreign flag, no political organizing, no bad-mouthing our president or his policies. These will lead to deportation.
    * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
    10. If you do come to this country illegally, you will be actively hunted &, when caught, sent to jail until your deportation can be arranged. All assets will be taken from you.
    * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
    The above laws are the current immigration laws of MEXICO

  13. James May 19, 2010 at 9:51 am

    Bob…

    two quick points… all law abiding citizens are in law abiding. all individuals that have entering the united states illegally are not lw abiding, doesn’t matter whether they entered yesterday or 10 years ago.

    your comment…I have never heard a person say, “I came to the U.S. because my income prospects were poor in Mexico”, as posted on this site. They frequently talk about not being able to feed their children and that they became so desperate to feed their family that they risked their lives crossing into the United States where they hoped to find work so they could send money home to the wife and children. …. what you’re saying they frequently talk about is what you say you’ve never heard a person say.!!! poor income prospects vs. provide for their family – same thing my friend…

  14. D. Patrick Wright May 19, 2010 at 11:40 am

    An illegal alien might be supposed to be such by any number of indicators not part of profiling. Such as, the people verbally stating that they are illegal aliens, relatives or aquaintances reporting them, to name only two obvious ones. Profiling also has a specific legal meaning, which I have not even addressed here. A person protesting htis law can’t just come up with their own legal definitions of terms–which is what is being done widely.

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